The Nebraska engine

[Lee]

What is the status of the Nebraska engine?Any timeline set?

Would be great to have another large engine running.

[Jerry Christiansen]

Hi Lee,

The Nebraska engine needs a friend.

While there has been talk about where to put the engine and the energy source for the engine, no one has stepped up to the plate to say, "I will head-up that job."

A debate is on going among the Stationary Steam people. Some want the Nebraska Engine up in the woods near the other large stationary engines.

Others say that too many trees would have to go and that area is too crowded all ready. They think we should spread out the large stationary engines to give people more oppertunities to see them.

As long as opened this up for discussion, let's keep it going.

Jerry Christiansen

[Lee]

Where it would go is probably a good start. How much room would it take? How big a steam source? I'm assuming the Montana boiler is pretty close to maxed out. I can see where it would be crowding that area in the woods, but it would almost seem out of place anywhere else. Just my 2cents.

I think this community forum is an excellant idea.It gets folks talking(typing?) about things that can be done.The ideas start flowing and people get inspired.The posts on this board are very positive and it is that energy that will keep WMSTR the best show in the world.

[Jerry Christiansen]

What say you Montana Crew? Is your boiler maxed out? When the Soo Enigne comes on line, will you be maxed out then?

None of the large engines are using much steam compared to what they would use running at speed and under load. If the Nebraska Engine was set up in our "corner" and if it didn't run at full speed, could the Montana supply the steam?

A related questions is: How hard do the people on the Montana want to work? Do they want to be throwing so much coal that firing the boiler is a "job" or do they want to have time to talk with the crowd and keep putting on a show like they do?

Jerry

[40avery]

We do have a Porter boiler that is resting. It could certainly be a very nice stationary boiler.

[Tim Moen]

Dog Gone It! I just spent an hour typing a lengthy post and when I tried to submit it went pooooooffff!!!! Told me I didn't have permission to. Teaches me to save my work. Rats.. Tim

[Tim Moen]

It worked that time. I'll try to remember what I wrote and send again. Tim

[40avery]

Tim,

I am sure you probably know but if you are not logged in it will kick your post like that. On my long posts I generally form them up in Word and then copy and paste it into the forum.

Thanks for participating on the forum. We are expecting a lot more activity when the next news letter comes out.:)

[Tim Moen]

Yes Rick, I was logged in but perhaps there is a time limit? Good idea on Word. Thanks! Tim

[Tim Moen]

All, The Montana Boiler is not maxed out yet although it is getting to be “busy” work keeping steam up. There was definitely more of a time lag between firings with the lump coal! With the stoker coal our grates are not up to the forced draft that we could put through them. The grates are in poor shape so we need to have new ones cast. I believe that we are getting a “rosebud” pattern made for this. The Montana was designed to operate at 350# pressures , as a result , it has only a 4 inch main from the boiler to the header. We operate at 150# because that is what our engines were designed for. When we have a good load on and draw a large volume of steam, the water level increases in the boiler an inch or two just from the velocity of the steam moving through the 4 inch main. When the Soo Line comes on line for good, we’re going to add a 6 inch main to the header to solve that problem. ( this has already had the blessing of the inspector) .

The Nebraska engine has been talked about for many years and no matter what seems like a good idea someone doesn’t like it or shoots it down for some reason or other so we gave up for awhile. Location would be a good thing to nail down. I personally would like to see it up by the other large stationary engines whether or not the Montana provides the steam. The Porter boiler could surely work but we have trouble finding and keeping staff and trainees as it is. Must be something about hand firing a boiler that doesn’t move! Ha! I’ll have to check the governor on the Nebraska to see if the cut-off will work to reduce the valve stroke enough to operate on governor at low speed and no load. The Villuame engine would seriously over-run before the valve cut-off by governor would take control. Jerry, I believe this is also the case for the Pabst? There is a tremendous amount of steam that is used and wasted even with a mostly closed throttle valve allowing steam on full (almost) stroke.

Anyway the FIRST thing that should be done (in my humble opinion) is to get ALL the information from those that disassembled the engine. I believe that Alton Moen (no relation) and the Withers crew were involved. Maybe Swed knows or was involved as well. Getting the engine here was voted on and approved at an annual or spring meeting at the Bowler 20-25 years ago. Maybe the minutes of that meeting could shed some light on who to contact. This will give some indication of the size of foundation we’re talking about. Then some areas could be eliminated due to sheer size alone and also get an idea of costs for concrete , forming , etc.. This should have been done BEFORE this engine was approved to be moved here. Also people to insure that it would be put together in a reasonable amount of time. Neal Hemminger and I know on the compressor, and Fred knows on the Soo what’s involved in restoring something that HAS to be here but sits for 20-30 years before being put together. ( The Nebraska was warm when it was taken out) Enough of the soap box. It CAN be done! I would be willing to help getting this thing going and I know that Karl Stange is interested as well. The more the merrier!

Thanks for letting me ramble! Tim Moen.

P.S. RESTORE IT AND WE’LL STEAM IT and then they will come!

[M Kerkvliet]

This is all news to me. Kind of embarrassing, being a board member and not knowing anything about it. I guess it was before my time. Where is the engine now? Sitting outside I suppose? I hope care has been taken to keep anything from getting busted (hard water) and from rusting away.

A little history on the engine would be a good thing for those of us who do not know it!

What are you doing up so late Tim?

[Tim Moen]

Sheese Mark! Same to you! I'm a horrible night owl and had to figure out the posting thing that worked for me. The Nebraska sits in the old bone-yard next to the tracks. Not to many people interested in it. Shame, Like the Soo engine, was dang near perfect when it got here. Tim

[Tim Moen]

Was at the hill last weekend getting my "T" but didn't go down to where it sits. Not much if anything was done to protect it in the last 5-10 years. I should reverse--not much was OBVIOUSLY done to protect it. I got the spark to really check it out. I'll fill you in on as much history as I know. When are you planning on a visit to the hill? Can meet you over there. Tim

[M Kerkvliet]

Sheese Mark! Same to you! I'm a horrible night owl and had to figure out the posting thing that worked for me.


I just got in off the road, from Sioux Falls. I usually check the forum before I go to bed. Then I can go so the same thing again tomorrow!

Thanks for all of the information on the Montana! That is just the kind of thing we are looking for here. If we can get folks from different areas of the grounds, that have the same kind of knowledge of their areas, that you have of yours... this is going to be a great resource!

Thanks again for participating Tim!

[40avery]

It is easy to trouble shoot any project after the fact. The truth is we learned a lot form the way the Nebraska was handled. The further truth is that it is here on site. Had we waited for all the pieces to fall into place it may not be.

The Soo engine sat for a long time too. We have it. It did not go to the scrapper and it will be an interesting display when it is finished.:D

To me Stationary engines like this are good projects because outside of the initial big cost of concrete, and in this case a building, most other work is busy work without a lot of costs associated.

Since I have been on the board I do not remember anyone bringing it to the board for an advisory opinion and there certainly has not been a budget proposal. You guys are already on the right track. Here is how to continue.

Get a project leader that will not give up on pursuing and organizing the project. This is important because it is probably a project that will take years to complete.

Pick a spot and make a plan and bring it to the board for review.

When your location is approved look things over again and create a budget proposal. Projects are considered for funding in October of each year.

Please remember that as it goes through the budget process there will be many many other projects competing for limited funds. It all takes time. Many projects have had to go through the budget process many times before they got partial funding. This is not because the project was not a good one. A committed group that presents well and shows the long term desire can get this done.

Start with what you have, not what you could have had, and take off from there. It could be a good project for bringing extra people on to your team.

Good luck.:bannana:

Please remember as the project progresses.:picture:

[Lee]

Do you think that something should be set up or have a meeting to see how many people are interested?How have the other large projects gotten started?Is this something that WMSTR long range planning has thought about?Thanks

[40avery]

Just a suggestion:

It seems from the posts that you have a good core group available right now. Tim has named a couple that have interest. Get the interested parties together on the show grounds and get some ideas together. As the project progresses you will have more people with interest come on board. If you can get your core group together prior to the Summer Meeting you can ask for a place on the agenda and let the group know what you are going to try and do.

If it seems like you can make it go get a few ideas about where it should go and then bring it to the board. Once you have the Idea and the place then you will have to get some estimates together and submit a budget proposal. There is a deadline for projects to be submitted for consideration. I think it is sometime in September. Your budget should include what you anticipate doing for the 1st year and some projections for what you will need down the road to complete the project. Projects are approved and funded on a year to year basis since things can change greatly in 12 months. As I said in my other post do not be surprised if it does not get funding in the first year it is proposed but don't give up.

This forum is also a great place to discuss the project. Once the newsletter goes out we will have a lot of members joining in. Many will have ideas that they will share.

Again - Good luck you are asking the right questions.:)

[Tim Moen]

Please understand I'm not sorry that the engine is here on the grounds or in ANY way faulting anyone for ANYTHING. I was at the meeting when it was voted on to bring the engine here and voted yay. My frustration lies in the fact that the engine has had minimal attention in even the barest effort of protection from elements. Hey! I am just as much to blame as anyone ( perhaps more so) because one of my areas of interest is stationary steam. To me, this interest because of this WONDERFUL forum, boosts my enthusiasm tremendously!!! When the newsletter comes out and we get even more people reading, my hope is that more would show interest. I would surely like to get together this spring to meet with folks and at LEAST get some protection on this engine. Also, I would like to have some contact names for long range planning people. Mark Neu?
Rick and others, My rant was due to my excitement! I resectfully apologise. Tim Moen

[40avery]

No apologies necessary Tim.

We are really happy to see that this forum is already bringing people of like interests together. We are such a big show that I sometimes think we all miss opportunities to come together with others that have like interests. I can see excitement building with you and several others here that could be the start of another team to do a restoration on the grounds. Preservation is certainly a valid concern. Let's talk sometime. I have a couple of ideas that may help you.:)

By the way the newsletter is due out very soon and we have an annoncement that this forum is up and running so there will soon be a lot more posts on all the threads here. It will bring further excitement on many porjects and areas of the show.:bannana:

[Lee]

I would certainly be interested in helping.I've been trying to find my place at Rollag, and this looks like good place.Just name the time and place.

[Jerry Christiansen]

.I've been trying to find my place at Rollag, and this looks like good place.


Lee,

What you said in your last message is an important statement for a lot of us "old timers" to see. We need to give people an oppertunity to find their place. We need to invite people to try our exhibit. Some times the person and the exhibit fit, some times they don't. If you try working in one area for a while and it doesn't seem right for you, look for something else. I believe there is a place for everyone at Rollag.

Some parts of Rollag need people that can run or operate a piece of equipment. Some parts of Rollag need people that can talk to our guests and explain what is going on. We need people to run the Administration Building (thank goodness we have a qualified bunch up there, especially during registration and during the show). We need people to pick up trash, scoop ice cream, run sound boards . . . . and the list goes on.

Wow, somebody (me) did a bit of rambling.

Keep looking, find your "home" or maybe "homes".

Later,
Jerry

[karl stange]

the history of the nebraska engine as i've been told:

the engine was donated to wmstr from the great western sugar factory in scottsbluff, nebraska. it was still operational at the time when around four or five wmstr members went down, disassembed the engine, and shipped/trailered the parts back up here. (are these people still around and could they give some insight or help?)

i'm not sure of the date ( early 80's ? ) when it was disassembled but others may know......

tim moen and myself have talked about plans for this engine over the past couple years in giving this engine a "home". but with the past rainy shows we're "still sitting on the fence" you might say. i have personal reasons why i will be involved with this engine. both my parents are and were from nebraska.

i've heard some comments already about placement. some say "too many [staionary engines] in one place", others say to "spread 'em around". i prefer this engine to be up by the montana boiler with the rest. there's a real nice spot northeast from the steam hammer.

if nothing else, i would at least like to see this engine inside a building as a static display to get it out of the elements.

i concur with others... this is excellant to have this forum to inform and keep wmstr on the growing path.

[M Kirschenman]

I spoke to Tim during the Larson welding steam up, and offered to make drawings. If somene else is willing to champion this (between the Freeport and the Machine shop I have enough to push for now), I would be willing to bring a computer with solid modeling software down to the grounds (its what I do all day anyway); with one helper we could inventory the parts and make a prety accurate model of the engine for designing the installation in less than a day. Even if someone has sketches or dimensions from when it was in service, a complete drawing with all the plumbing, foundation and building makes project planning and work MUCH easier (and the visual helps to draw people into it).

So who wants to step up to the plate and lead here?

As for location, I'll through out a few suggestions
1. Move the Ortner and give it some real track to run on, put engine where Ortner RR is.
2. Put Engine NE or roundhouse; I know of a 40hP steam air compressor that would go with this and supply air to the roundhouse and machine shop (hidden motive here, obviously)

Just shooting off my mouth again :p

-MK

[40avery]

Two great suggestions Mark. Let's see some posts from others.:bannana:

[Lynette]

Just to help with the background of the Nebraska engine: Those who were on the real job of tearing down and moving the Nebraska were Jim Todahl,
Mike Johnson (New Folden, Mn), Smitty (Elroy) Amundson, possibly Bob Glass (he was one who was very the interested in the Nebraska-not sure if he accompanied them to tear it down.) I do have ALL the photos of this project---2 big piles--that were taken during the disassembling. They should prove very helpful when this project gets a 'champion' and crew to begin work.
Lynette

[Timkerk]

I am starting a new job next week and I am not sure how my life is going to proceed. With that being said I would possibly be interested helping out with this project. I am very mechanically inclined and I have some common sense when it comes to construction and mechanical things. Please keep me informed and I will offer some sweat and back work. I think my new job may leave me with more weekends open.

[karl stange]

I do have ALL the photos of this project---2 big piles--that were taken during the disassembling.Lynette

lynette,

do you know if the guys who went down there recieved any history or information about the engine besides taken the photos (which will be very helpful)?
maybe even some plan drawings?

[Lee]

Would any of the people interested in the engine, be at the summer meeting on 6-2-07? Maybe the wheels could get rolling.:bannana:

(Dancing banana is so cool.)

[jasher]

It would seem to me the first thing to do would be to get all the parts together in one DRY place. That would probably require the P&H and/or the Big Ugly.

The place???? Perhaps the triangle between the old and new mainline tracks west of the Pennsilvania. Arey/Muhl might not like it, but that spot is accesable via Big Ugly and relitivity well drained. It also would have the benifit of being observed by xx,000 people riding the train saying "when are you going to put that together?" We need to unload ties from Expo flat anyway. At least this would get the parts out of the slough hole the're in now and would also fufill the "must be moved 3 times" rule.

[Jerry Christiansen]

Jerry,

Your post has several good points. Let's see if we can get the engine moved and sitting on some kind of blocking in a drier place. If we can clear the location you mentioned with the railroad crew, I think that would be a good place.

Later,
Jerry

[Kenronsberg]

For those not closley involve with the railroad, I would like to interperit the paragraph above by Jerry Asher.
We should compile all of the parts from the Nebraska Engine and get them high and dry. This will involve the P&H truck crane or the railroad crane.
I think it we could put it between our new mainline tracks and the old tracks now used as a siding just west of the Pennsilvania engine building. Gary Aery and Gary Muhl may not be happy, as they have worked very hard cleaning up that area however it is accesable with the railroad crain, and the drainage is relatively good in that area. In that spot it would be seen by thousands of people riding the train, who would pester us to make it run.

The interperitave center is not sure what unloading the ties from the Expo flat car has to do with this project, but we do have a team looking into this sentence.
This will get the engine high and dry, and we will have spent enough time moving it from place to place that we can do something productive with the Enging in question.
Ken Ronsberg

[vnanosky]

The interperitave center is not sure what unloading the ties from the Expo flat car has to do with this project, but we do have a team looking into this sentence.


I am guessing that we could use the Expo flat car to move the pieces so that would mean that we would have to unload the ties?:confused:

[jasher]

OK Mr Smarty Pants at the AIC-you want to tackle the Clase Fat project?

[vnanosky]

OK Mr Smarty Pants at the AIC-you want to tackle the Clase Fat project?

Were you referring to the Case Flat (Clase Fat)?

We are not in charge of track or rolling stock.:biglaugh:

[Kenronsberg]

I think Asher either meant Classy Fat, or his bridge slipped while trying to sound out the words.... or could be french Clase' Fat ? Clawnece!
Ken:biglaugh:

[dclong]

I think it is great how everyone is coming together to begin this worthwhile project. Lynette mentioned earlier in this thread the she has a couple piles of photographs pertaining to the Nebraska. I would be willing to put these photos together (as best I can) in a readable, book type fashion. I could also scan the photos to create backups of them. This would also allow everyone to have a copy of them (on CD) to take home with them to study and ponder. If you guys think this would be helpful to you and if someone else isnt already doing it, let me know and I'll do what I can to get it done.

[Lee]

That would be a great idea.With the technology that is out there, anything is possible.

[Lee]

OK, this may sound like a really stupid question, but does the Nebraska engine have two flywheels? On the North side of the tracks by Steam Hollow is four flywheel halves. Is there more than one engine there?:confused:

[Ned]

I'm lost :confused: here I thought we were talking about a steam engine and then it turned into a classy fat chick :hide: and then something about the RR where are we? I'm willing to help but please :praying: lets focus on the project at hand!

Erik the ned

sorry just had to add on two bits

[karl stange]

seeing how the intersest in this engine is rising. just to throw this out there...

how many of you out there are willing to commit to a pre-planning stage type of a meeting? (could be setup to meet at an agreed spot. say.. the mercantile? at some point?)

granted, living far away is a hinderance but even if we had enough close rollag and the surrounding area support and input. we can always keep everyone informed about the progress here on this post.

i have found out thru the internet that all documentation from great western sugar was donated to the colorado state university library at fort collins, co. the reply i recieved was from a librarian stating about a listing of all documentation recieved (which i downloaded into word). also about great western sugar's magazine publication called the "sugar press" which the feb-mar-apr- 1962 issue has information about the scottsbluff factory construstion in 1910. if any one can find this publication it would be awesome!!

while i was transmission line surveying out in this area back in 1988 +/-. i took some outside shots of this factory. yes, the sugar industry has a major influence on my whole families life. as my dad retired from american crystal after 40 years.

[karl stange]

how many of you out there are willing to commit to a pre-planning stage type of a meeting? (could be setup to meet at an agreed spot. say.. the mercantile? at some point?)

send me a p.m. if you're interested (forgot to include this). i recently talked with lynette and she's hunting down those photos.

[M Kirschenman]

For those of you who haven’t heard, Tim Moen :bannana: agreed to champion this project for 1 year, and had a budget of $450 to stabilize and preserve the engine approved at the Fall Meeting this weekend. Tim and I dug around the pile this morning to get a better idea of what’s where, and how far things have sunk into the mud (quite a bit). We decided that the best action plan at this point is to get everything out of the mud hole early next spring (say April) when there is minimal vegetation and move it to a dry spot where it can be placed on cribbing. This would also be a good time to get the other porter frame out also. At this point we’ll inspect for severe damage, inventory the parts, and make drawings. Of particular concern, the steam inlet to the main cylinder (which of course is right on the top) has been wide open :mad: all of this time and it’s possible that stiff water could have cracked out the internals. Until we examine things carefully, nobody really knows for sure if this can be restored, or if we’re better off scrapping it.

An anonymous individual :D (see last Feb posts) suggested the triangle east of the Elbow Lake shed, between the main line and the siding for the temporary staging area. That same location was suggested again today. It’s open, flat, and reachable by the Big Ugly; best of all, the railroad crew was thoughtful enough to leave plenty ties for cribbing there. I suppose we have to ask them if that spot’s OK. If not, we would really like suggestions for another suitable spot (not that many when you start looking).

I've agreed to assist Tim in this effort, and make the mechanical drawings required for installation and reassembly. So if you know of anyone who was information (drawings, dimensions, pictures) please pass them on to us this winter.

Webmaster - could we get a new forum area set up for the Nebraska Engine?

-MK

[Tim Moen]

Dog Gun It Mark!! You're a faster driver than I! Yes It's true--- I took this on as a One Year Contract!!!!!!! My purpose and goal is to get the engine out of the mud and determine if it is in the best interest of the show to preserve the engine or let it go to the scrappers. I Need Help!!! Thanks to Mark and Karl and and and--- For the help so far! Tim

[Tim Moen]

Now for the details... We found the big parts(duh) and one pallet of brightwork or piping. In our quick tour I realized that I need many bodies next spring to help go through the grass and trees to find EVERYTHING that we can for the Nebraska. Not only that, but, the spare parts for the Porter. Talked to Gary Muhl about help with the lifting and it sounds like early next spring would be the best time for the transplant!! (Come on --The three move rule???) ANY ONE interested in old rusty iron please post or PM me or Mark. Like I said WE Need Help!! More Details To Follow. Tim Moen

[karl stange]

thought i'd post the email correspondance i recieved. in case anyone out in the colorado area would may be kind enough to spend a day or two searching records. just a thought. i'm still investigating here in minnesota on line.

also, besides #29 post for placemnet of this engine (neat to see the ortner up on the expo grounds) does anyone have any other spots on the show grounds? just throwing this out...
- behind the freeport building
- or closer to the soo/pabst building west side
- i still like over by the montana


From : Watkins,Shan <swatkins@library.colostate.edu>
Sent : Monday, April 16, 2007 3:34 PM
CC : <shan.watkins@colostate.edu>
Subject : RE: Archives Contact Form,great western sugar factory photos

Dear Mr. Stange,

Thank you for your inquiry regarding the Great Western Sugar Company collection. Unfortunately, we don't have any photographs of the steam engine from the Scottsbluff factory. We only have photos of the exterior of that factory.

While the Great Western Sugar Company collection can not be accessed via the internet, our collection finding aid is available online - http://lib.colostate.edu/archives/findingaids/agriculture/agws.html. If there is anything in the finding aid that you would like to view, we can make photocopies or scan images for you.

While CSU received most of the Great Western photographic material, the textual records of the Great Western Sugar Company are preserved in the Western Americana collection in the Archives of the University of Colorado at Boulder. According to our Agricultural Archivist, CU-Boulder also has a full run of the Sugar Press publication put out by GW. The Feb-Mar-Apr 1962 issue of the Sugar Press contains information about the Scottsbluff factory construction in 1910. The website for the CU archives is http://ucblibraries.colorado.edu/archives/collections/western.htm.

Good luck with your research.

Kind regards,

Shan Watkins
Library Tech III
Archives & Special Collections
CSU Libraries

:picture:

[Ray Wangler]

Tim, I’m happy to see you on the job! Hopefully it will work out to be more than a single year assignment. Feel free to drag old friends into the work.

Later

Ray

[Todd Hintz]

Tim,
I attended the steam school two years ago, and am looking for an area of the show to help with and get some hours on a steam engine. I'd like to help when possible (I'm four hours from Rollag in WI) I'll keep checking here for work days and count me in. Thanks.
Todd

[Tim Moen]

Anyone who is interested in the Nebraska going to be at the Hill Nov,17th for woodcutting? I will be there and could be a chance to look over things again if there is no snow.. Jeff, I have a family function in Fargo on Friday so won't be going through Fosston. Can you still go? Will call you before to be sure. Thanks to everyone who has shown interest!! Respectfully, Tim

[Jerry Christiansen]

Hi Tim,

Count me in for woodcutting and looking at the Nebraska. I will get there sometime before 9:00am.

Later,
Jerry Christiansen

[Lee]

Tim, I plan on going the 17th to Rollag. I should be there about 8:30-9:00 unless I hit it big at the casino.
:woohoo1:

[Mike McKnight]

Until we examine things carefully, nobody really knows for sure if this can be restored, or if we’re better off scrapping it.


-MK


Just as an outsider looking in, why on earth would you consider scrapping this engine????? I don't care how bad it is! I mean, it might not be fesible to restore to working condition, but seems to me that something cleaned up and painted as a static display is WAY better than sending to the scrap yard....

Mike

[Kenronsberg]

Mike,
I don't speak for the board of directors, and while scrapping an engine isn't exactly preserving the past WMSTR dosen't have static displays. If it dosen't run it dosen't have a home here. We don't make a practice of scrapping steam engines. Perhaps rather than sending it to the scrapper a better solution could to be to offer it to another show that has museum pieces that don't operate. I think the cost of setting up an engine to look at that does nothing when the funds could be used on an operational display dosen't seem to be wise, not to mention the volunteer time involved. I hope the engine is still restorable and can be added to our show, but not as a museum piece.
Ken Ronsberg

[Mike McKnight]

Ken,
I definitely feel a static piece is preferable to scrapping, but I can understand with the cost of setting up a large stationary engine and the cost of cosmetically restoring it, the money could be better spent to set up one that CAN run. Concrete and crane time ain't cheap!

However, I like your alternative suggestion of finding a museum, collector, or other show that would erect it as static if WMSTR finds it not feasible to restore. If it comes to that, I might could point you towards a large collector who has the equipment to handle it and the funds to set it up. Just let me know if it comes to that....

A few years ago I myself made a habit of snapping up old stationary steam engines, of varying sizes, including some that aren't exactly easily or cheaply restorable, just to keep them from going to scrap. Some are restored, some are "rusting in peace" quietly in the pasture. With the price of scrap nowadays, am glad to say I did it when I could. :)

Mike

[40avery]

It seems like you guys have got the right Idea. Mark will have to weigh in on what he meant but I think he was simply saying that they want to look it over and make certain it is viable for an active display. If not the idea of setting it up will be scrapped and what happens to the hardware then is going to be up to the board.

Ken is right. As a rule we want working displays. A case in point is the Mt.St. Helens car. It could not be used on our rails and we could not afford the restoration without cutting back on most other projects for about three years running. Instead of letting it deteriorate further we opted to sell it at a favorable price to someone that can and will restore it.

We have to be a little careful on what we read into some of these threads. Typed words can be misunderstood very easily if we want to.

Thanks for the comments guys. I have every confidence that the situation will be handled the best way possible. :)

[Tim Moen]

All, Yes there will be a decision made by this coming summer as to whether it is feasable and economically possible to restore the engine to operational status. It will NOT be haphazardly scrapped. Ken is right on-- We at WMSTR have operational displays ,and if it seems that we can not do a display justice by having it warm and running, we will seek many alternatives BEFORE the ultimate sin of scrapping occours! (by the way Mike, if it comes to the point that we can't restore-- I definialtly want to talk to you!!) The concern that Mark and I have is that the top of the main steam chest and cylinder has been open to the water. If ,when we crack the head and see that the main bore has cracked--- It's all over folks.. ( as an afterthought the Corliss valve bores will be checked as well ). The main goal for this coming year will be to get the engine out of the mud and on dry ground, covered, and sprayed to prevent further corrosion. Rick, respectfully, I do like the fact that someone may not understand fully what we are talking about or what we say on the Forum. It allows a question to be asked and (hopefully) answered. If it were not for the (scrapped) comment, we wouldn't have Mike give us an alternative to the junkman! Anyway-- thanks again for the interest in the Nebraska. Keep this thread going! Will post more after this coming weekend. Respectfully, Tim Moen.

[Tim Moen]

As you may have seen, we have our own sub-catagory that comes up on the main Forum page. Thanks to Mark K. and the board for setting this up. Been busy with Thanksgiving and Christmas is coming way to soon. Will have time to devote to the project in a couple of weeks. Everyone thanks again for posting and PM's . Keep the ideas coming. Merry Christmas everyone!! Tim.

[M Kirschenman]

I remember someone mentioning that that one of the Withers has the governor and possibly some other parts to this engine. Can anyone contact Jim or Kevin (or forward a phone #) and find out the truth to this rumor (I hope someone has it in safekeeping)?

Also, It just occurred to me that when Tim and I dug through the pile, I don't recall seeing the dashpot assemblies or any lubricators either. Anyone know where other parts could have wandered off to? Are there any other possible parts stashes out there?

-MK

[Jerry Christiansen]

I believe the governor is easy to find. Look on the east side of the Pabst Building and you will see a large governor on a stand that Byron built.

Later,
Jerry Christiansen

[Ned]

I thought I would post my two bits on the engine here. Tim, Karl, my brother and myself have been talking about this for sometime now, and its great to see the responses from new members and young members. Its makes me proud to be a member to see people come together and keep a piece of history alive ;) . If we don't who will?
Now for the fun part we took a look a the engine during wood cutting and yes come spring we will need alot of help digging through the over grown weeds. Some of the pallets parts were sitting on have rotted away others the earth has started to reclaim. More updates in April :praying:
Is there a building we can put small stuff or somewhere safe that it won't be in the way?

Ned
Happy New Year to ALL !!!

[Dustin D Ehli]

Hi, I would also be very interested in helping out with the Nebraska engine, Some of you know me, I know Jerry Does. Ive always just been a spectator at the show but have been looking for a place to help out.
Who do i talk to about getting in on this engine project.
Thanks
Dustin Ehli

[Tim Moen]

Ok, I know it's going to be -22 below here tonight. but my thoughts are at the point when Global Warming is going to appear here shortly. Thank You all for the interest in the Nebraska--- BUT--- we need help from anyone with pictures or firsthand knowledge on this engine. I will coordinate with the group to get the engine out of the mud, but, we need help to make sure we can go further with it. Anybody who knows where there are parts spread out around the grounds-- let me know!! I will check above the sawmill with Jim. We will start making a plan for late? April. Jeff Lee has done alot of phone and other work on this as well as others. Thanks!! Get ahold of myself of Jeff through the Forum or PM's. Ray--I will be calling on old and new friends!! Tim.

[Ned]

Are we still planning a fieldtrip down there this weekend? To get the cylinder out of the frozen tundra and up on some ties before that area turns into a swamp again.

Erik the ned

[Jerry Christiansen]

Ned,

This weekend? How will that fit with Steam Up?

Later,
Jerry Christiansen

[Ned]

Jerry,

After the food is eaten and the B.S. sessions are done and engines are put away til another day. Tim M my brother Ed and Myself usually head down to see how thing faired over the winter.

Erik

[Tim Moen]

Ned, I am planning to stay at the Hill this weekend. I hope for 50 degree days this week so the snow will go down some more! Ira and I stopped at the hill yesterday and there is no way to get to Snob Hill or to the engine easily yet. One way or another see you at steam-up and then we can plan for attack! Tim

[haberaj]

Tim
Any thoughts on a date yet, weather is finally geting warmer and dryer, at least down here by Elk River
Andy

[Tim Moen]

Tell me, May,2?? Gots a Lots of work for my girls. So see you at the Hill???Tim.

[haberaj]

Friday, May 2nd, I can make that work, Saturday also?
What equipment/ tools are needed besides sweat and shovels?
What time and where?:)

[Tim Moen]

Well-Well-Well. Another 16 inches of snow.. Blasphamy!!!!! I doubt with temps only in the 40s-50s this coming week that we will be able to do much scrounging for pieces and parts. Way to wet and muddy. With that in mind, how about May10-11? Anyone? Is this OK? Feel free to post or send me a PM. Good Gravy!! Only 6 weeks till Steam School and Kids Day!! Thanks Tim Moen.

[haberaj]

Tim's tried to set a couple dates so far, last suggestion of the 10th/ 11th, weather seems to finally be breaking down here in the south, hows it looking up there? If the weather holds who's up for this weekend?

[mrnewway]

Tim:
I would be happy to lend your crew a hand when I am back there, I will fit it in between the gas engine area projects I have planned.

Jim out west:):)

[Tim Moen]

Well, this weekend looks to be OK for a gathering. May 11,12. I hope the Mothers will approve! Andy I sent you a PM but will say here that Friday I need to get things organized in my camp site so let's shoot for Sat morning to get busy with the engine. Jim, you are most welcome to help anytime!
This weekend we'll try to get the water drained and scavange for as many parts that we can find! Tim.

[Tim Moen]

First of all I would like to apologize for the @#$$%## weather. For those that can make it, this weekend(11-12), will be a gathering to look at and discuss things about the Nebraska Engine. I will be on the Hill Friday night(late) on Snob Hill. Unofficial official time to start on Sat. morn is 9:00 A.M. at the OK Corral potties. Call me at 218-766-5265 cell if you have issues! Tim...

[Tim Moen]

Our first weekend of work.... well Sunday! Let me thank Andy, Jeff L., Jeff N., Tyson S., Karl S., for braving the sn#$w on Saturday. Not much as far as finding iron, but, getting the boom-truck operational was a great plus!!!! Sunday- Andy, Tyson, Jeff N., and myself got some iron pulled out of the way. Thanks to Vern we had a gas powered pump to get alot of the water drained. We have separated some of the parts onto the dry areas around there but need to go further. NOTHING IN THE AREA IS SCRAP!!!!!!!! The next weekend for Nebraska work is Memorial Weekend. Please P.M. or post if you are interested--it makes it easier to see how many people will be there to help. Anyone with ideas on how to manuver(sic) 15 tons of mainframe--let me know.. Tim Moen

[Kenronsberg]

Tim,
I think your answer is Gary Muhl and Big Ugly. For non-Railroad folks, Big Ugly is the Railroad Crane. Not to be confused with Jerry Asher our Railroad Superintendant.
Ken Ronsberg

[Tim Moen]

Ken, we looked at that. Gary will have to determine if the big-ugly would be over-extended picking up the big pieces. You reminded me of another idea. Has to do with a BIG balloon, a soapbox,and a certain individual. Should work--right? Tim.

[Lee]

Tim is right. There is a lot of parts that need to be sorted out and identified. Hopefully when it warms up and dries out all the parts can be found and seperated. It looks like there is at least three engines in the area.

http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll175/65Case/RollagMay102008001.jpg

There was a little bit of water down by the cylinder, but that was pumped out on Sunday. When the cylinder is pulled out and the valves taken out then we can get a better idea if there is any water damage inside.

http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll175/65Case/RollagMay102008024.jpg

Here is a photo from Saturday after the line truck got running.

http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll175/65Case/RollagMay102008030.jpg

Well that should do it for me until Memorial Day weekend.
Does anybody know what happened to the builders tag that was screwed to the side of the cylinder? Or recall what the tag said? Thanks

[M Kerkvliet]

Good pictures Jeff, and good work all! The pictures show the scale of the job you have undertaken! Looks to me like it will take most of the summer just to get all of the parts with the right engines!

Good to see the line truck doing some work. I know Klinger and Louie have done a lot of work on that truck to get it running in the past. Would be nice if it can be kept in good running order so it is always available for this kind of work.

If Gary thinks that the Big Ugly is going to be a little "stretched" as far as it's lifting capacity, you can always get in touch with Ken Ekre and use the wheeled crane to load the parts... onto what I am not sure.

Also, be sure you check with everyone involved with the different areas of the grounds before you do any unloading. Would hate to have a bunch of complaints about "why did that have to go here"! The Board is going to meet on "Breakfast on the Farm" weekend if we can be of any help with this.

Keep up the great work guys!

[40avery]

Tim,

Big ugly is what put the peices there it should be able to get them out again. Definitly talk to Gary.

Rick

[karl stange]

we never did get back out on saturday during the snow to take pictures...

we did get the all important planning meeting taken care of, so next time we meet.......

[karl stange]

i know tim moen has planned for a sorting party this coming memorial weekend for this engine and the rest of the engines that are there.

not sure if i'll be there this coming memorial weekend because of family committments, otherwise, i'll be on the hill.

i brought out 4 pallets this past weekend to store "found" engine parts on and planning to bring more.



we have permission from kevin and jim withers to use as of right now four of the recently discarded heavy timbers and possibly more. thank you kevin and jim withers!:dancingparty:

[mrnewway]

It was good to see the LINE TRUCK pictured and ready to do some work on this project. It in itself is a part of history that should be preserved one can see what has happened to the NEBRASKA ENGINE!!!
Lets look at some type of inside or at least covered storage for it.

Jim out west:):)

[Tim Moen]

I am sorry for the short notice here. I wasn't sure what time I would be available this weekend. I am promised out for a few things this weekend that my wonderful daughters have been patiently waiting for. (it has to do with Steamer Hill so I'll be on the grounds). I have pictures (thanks to Karl) for a few to have fun and look for the small parts. Need a crew to give the boom truck a little help. (talk to me)- Need some good chains. If anyone has BIG wrenches in their tool kit, we need those. Jacks, BIG pry bars and some blocking would be a BIG help. (thanks to Withers Inc. we have some big help there). ---- Saturday Morning 9 or so lets meet at the Nebraska to group and BS. Anyone got a BIG coffee pot? I'll check here and PM tomorrow morning for any questions or comments. Serious questions call 218-766-5265. Thank you all, Tim

[haberaj]

Should have posted these a few weeks ago.
The Nebraska engine is still progressing, these came during Steam School weekend, sorry for the quality, only had a disposable camera. At this point we haven't moved the engine, we filled in the ditch so we could work on high ground, what you can't see is the hand dug ditch behind it that weaves it's way through the Porter frame.
I have'nt been able to come back up sine Fathers Day but am planning on being back next weekend and have no idea what has happened since. Tim check your PM and give me a call.
Andy